Final Cut Pro 10.8.1 - problem with HDR videos since upgrading to MacOS Sequoia

Other apps have no probleM so it has to be a compound bug in the way FCP outputs to the TV but down to some difference between Sequioa and Sonoma. You obviously know what you’re doing with HDR and it worked in Sonoma. I think you should file a bug report with Apple.

A small correction that may be important if this happens to be a bug and you want to report it: in the image where you are showing the washed out image in the tv, it is not used as extended desktop but as "av output".

It seems that perhaps FCP is not sending its AV Output properly as HDR.

Thanks Luis. Yes, I should've clarified that. In FCPX it's AV Output. But in System Settings I have to put that 3rd monitor as "Extended Desktop" and I have to enable "HDR output". Two different locations.

PF_Productions wrote:

Thanks Luis. Yes, I should've clarified that. In FCPX it's AV Output. But in System Settings I have to put that 3rd monitor as "Extended Desktop" and I have to enable "HDR output". Two different locations.

I think this is relevant, and it is also relevant that taking a screenshot apparently shows things correctly, whereas a photo of the screen exhibits the problem.

So, two observations:

1) The file appears to correctly encoded, and the problem lies in how it is sent to the external display.

2) It would be interesting to know what happens if you set the Viewer to that display, instead of AV monitor.

Would the media played back on the viewer, on the external display, show as it does in the internal, or as it does in AV monitor?

And - sorry if this has been asked and answered before - what is the Color Profile selected for the external display? Could that be the problem?

Luis,

1) Correct!

2) If I mirror the Built in display to the external LG TV, it shows it in HDR! But it's less than ideal as it's not a full screen image. It's the Final Cut viewer with the rest of that info on the screen and the image I want to view is smaller within that frame.

I sent a bug report in to Apple via Final Cut Pro, I'm not a developer or have any betas.

I'm curious why no one is noticing this though? Does no one edit HDR on a laptop and output a full screen image to a large 50" or larger TV? The HDMI is right there on the machine so it's so simple to set up!

Thanks for the help everyone, I hope they address it soon in the next update.

I encountered this problem on the first day of the public (not beta) release of Sequoia 15.0. Immediately contacted support and have talked to several advisors since with no resolution in site. Editing to add that the 4th person I spoke to elevated the issue to an engineer about a week ago, but the engineer hasn't gotten back to the advisor yet. This happens on my M1 desktop all the time and my Mac Laptop when it's hooked up to an external monitor. It doesn't happen on the laptop's internal screen.

I'm working with an LG C3 color calibrated monitor that's hooked up directly to the HDMI port (not going through an UltraStudio type device), but I tested it with 3 consumer-grade HDR monitors ranging in price from $300 to $1500 on both machines.

When working with an HLG project, all HDR clips appear dark in the browser and the viewer when I hover over them in the browser and the timeline. When I switch the project to PQ (including setting the proper monitor's metadata in the project settings), the clips display fine in the viewer if I hover over them in the timeline, but they display dark in the viewer and the browser when I hover over them in the browser.

I tested several different projects using footage from several different cameras, and they all have issues. If I open those same projects on a Mac with Sonoma, they work correctly.

I have been working with HDR timelines for over 5 years and know how to probably set up the project types and edit/conform footage between color spaces.

To test more, I went to an Apple Store and tried to duplicate the issue on a Mac mini and a Mac Studio that were hooked up to the $1599 Mac Studio monitor via USB-C, and I couldn't duplicate it. So, it either seems to be an issue with the computers talking to the monitor.

I typically have edited and exported my HDR projects in HLG, but I have since switched to editing in PQ. The clips are still dark when I hover over them in the browser, so it's difficult to mark in/out points, but they look fine once added to the timeline, so I can work with it.

This issue does not occur with DaVinci Resolve Studio 19.0.1 or 19.0.2, which was released yesterday.

Hey Clint, I'm having this same issue on my LG C3 and 3 other monitors and not going through a that I tested. They were all hooked up directly to the HDMI port and not going through an UltraStudio type device. I went to an Apple Store and did some testing using a Mac mini and a Mac Studio, which were both hooked up to a Mac Studio monitor via USB-C, and I couldn't duplicate the problem. It seems it may be an issue with MacOS talking to external monitors or possibly when they are connected through HDMI. My monitors don't support USB-C, so I can't hook them up that way to verify.

Hi Clint. I typically edit and export in HLG but switching to PQ partially fixes the issue. The clips display properly in the viewer when I hover over them in the timeline, but they display dark in the browser and viewer when I hover over them in the browser. This makes marking in/out points difficult because the viewer displays the clip at like 10 nits, but I can work with it.

I know I'm super late to these posts, but the issue does seem to be related to how the Mac is communicating to external monitors. I replied to one of your other posts, and the issue occurs on my M1 desktop when tested on 4 different monitors connected directly to the HDMI port, but I couldn't duplicate the issue at an Apple Store using their demo Mac mini or Mac Studio hooked up to the Mac Studio monitor via USB-C at an apple store. They don't have the XDR on display, so I couldn't test that.

My M1 laptop displays correctly on the internal HDR display in all modes (HLG & PQ), but it acts the same as the desktop when hooked up via HDMI to any of the 4 monitors I tested with. Unfortunately, none of the monitors I tested support USB-C connections, so I couldn't test with different connections.

Hi - I'm curious. Is the monitor you're using with the Mac mini M2 an Apple monitor? I'm asking because I went to an Apple Store and couldn't replicate the error on the demo Mac mini M2 or the Mac Studio Ultra they had on display. Both were connected to Apple Studio displays via Thunderbolt 4.

My thinking is the issue is happening to all non-Apple displays, no matter how they're hooked up, but if you have an Apple monitor, that theory is out the widow.

From what I've been seeing, people with Apple displays aren't having this issue. Another poster in this thread said they're not experiencing the issue with their XDR display and a MacPro.

Tried to edit my post, but it wouldn't let me - I've spoken with tech support about this multiple times, but they don't have any updates. Last update I received was in mid-October saying they'd get back to me once they hear something from engineering. I reached out today for an update but haven't heard anything yet. It's been two months since Sequoia was release and the problem first appeared.

To keep things simple, I have been using HDR footage from the iPhone, but it does happen with all footage from any camera.

The issue isn’t with the exported projects. It’s a display issue inside the app, where the clips appear dark in the viewer. Exported projects display correctly, even if you can barely see them on the screen to edit them.

When working with an HLG project, hovering over a clip in the browser or the timeline, it appears dark in the viewer.

When working with a PQ project, the clips appear dark in the viewer when hovering over them in the browser, but they display correctly in the viewer once added to the timeline.

The issue appeared immediately after upgrading to Sequoia and opening a project that worked perfectly in Sonoma, and they continue to work correctly on non-Sequoia machines, even if the monitor is the same as the one on the Sequoia machine. That’s what makes me think it’s an OS issue and not an FCP issue.

I’m the opposite of you. I don’t have any monitors that support Thunderbolt/USB-C, but I went to an Apple Store and tested on the demo machines hooked up to a studio monitor, and didn’t have the issue.

At home I tested on several HDR monitors ranging from a low quality gaming monitor to an Atomos Shinobi 7-Inch 4K HDMI HDR monitor, an LG C3 and a borrowed Flanders Scientific XMP310, all hooked up via HDMI. All except the gaming monitor have been calibrated and are using the calibrated profiles. Normally the Flanders is used with an UltraStudio 4K Mini, but for the sake of testing I hooked it up directly to the Mac’s HDMI.

I hope I explained this OK. It’s kind of hard to write it out to be easily understandable. When I called Apple support, they didn’t even know about HDR footage and kept calling it HGL instead of HLG, and the support rep said I was teaching them things they didn’t know about.

If you copy the Rec.2020 HLG video from the iPhone to your Mac, does it have tags 9-18-9 as shown by doing CMD+I in Quicktime Player and examining Video Details?

If it has those tags, does it play as expected in Quicktime Player? If not, this problem has nothing to do with FCP.

In MacOS System Settings>Displays, what color profile is selected for the HDR monitor?

Thanks for the detailed response, but what people aren’t understanding is 1) the HDMI port on the MacBook Pro DOES put out HDR for everything BUT FROM FCPX! It is HDR with the desktop image I put on it etc. It is SDR out of FCP since Sequoia. And 2) it worked flawlessly before Sequoia!

I’m talking about hooking an external monitor to the built in HDMI port of the laptop, and in FCP, you use that monitor as an external program feed. If you have a laptop, try it out! The desktop image you use for that screen and anything you drag to it is HDR, once in FCP it will be dull and not HDR while the laptop screen shows as HDR! Doesn’t matter if it’s iPhone HDR, or shot on a professional camera in Rec2020. The monitor will only show everything in SDR, and yes, all my FCP settings should send out HDR, the projects did before Sequoia.

It used to work perfectly and Sonoma broke it. Neither FCP 11 or any Sequoia updates have fixed it.

@joema - You're correct - the color points are 9-18-9, primaries BT.2020 and color transfer BT.2100 (HLG).

The clips display correctly everywhere except in FCP. No issues in Preview, QuickTime, Resolve Studio or any other programs. It's only in the viewer in FCP.

The color profiles have custom names because the monitors have been calibrated, but for HLG testing, I'm using Video Range 64-940, Gamut 2020, EOTF HLG and Luminance 1000. For PQ,Full Range 0-1023, Gamut 2020 (but have tested with P3-D65), EOTF PQ and Luminance 1000.

I'm configuring the settings in FCP's HDR Mastering Display Metadata section, correctly when working with a PQ project, but not HLG since they don't have/use embedded metadata.